march part 5: Dnyana once revealed takes time to steady itself.

 https://selfdefinition.org/ramana/Talks-with-Sri-Ramana-Maharshi--complete.pdf

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Talk 112. Mr. P. Brunton, while reading Upadesa Manjari, came across the statement that the ego, the world and God are all unreal. He desired to use a different word for God or at least a qualifying adjective, e.g. the Creative Force or personal God. 

Sri Bhagavan explained that God means samashti - i.e. all that is, plus the Be-ing - in the same way as ‘I’ means the individual plus the Be-ing, and the world means the variety plus Be-ing. 

The Be-ing is in all cases real. The all, the variety and the individual is in each case unreal. So also in the union of the real and the unreal, the mixing up or the false identification is wrong. It amounts to saying sad-asadvilakshana, i.e. transcending the real and the unreal - sat and asat. Reality is that which transcends all concepts, including that of God. Inasmuch as the name of God is used, it cannot be true. The Hebrew word Jehovah = (I am) expresses God correctly. Absolute Be-ing is beyond expression.

......

Sri Bhagavan pointed out the parallel passage in Dakshinamurti stotram to signify that the pictures are like reflections in a mirror; again from the Upanishad - as in the mirror, so in the world of manes, as in the water, so in the world of Gandharvas; as shadow and sunlight in Brahma Loka.

.....

Talk 122. 

A crowd had gathered here during Christmas. 

D.: How to attain Unity Consciousness? 

M.: Being Unity Consciousness how to attain it? Your question is its own answer. 

D.: What is Atman (Self), anatman (non-self) and paramatman (Supreme Self)? 

M.: Atman is jivatman (the individual Self) and the rest are plain. The Self is ever-present (nityasiddha). Each one wants to know the Self. What kind of help does one require to know oneself? People want to see the Self as something new. But it is eternal and remains the same all along. 

They desire to see it as a blazing light, etc. How can it be so? 

It is not light, not darkness (na tejo, na tamah). It is only as it is. It cannot be defined.

 The best definition is ‘I am that I am.’ 

The Srutis speak of the Self as being the size of one’s thumb, the tip of the hair, an electric spark, vast, subtler than the subtlest, etc. They have no foundation in fact.

 It is only Being, but different from the real and the unreal. 

It is Knowledge, but different from knowledge and ignorance.

 How can it be defined at all?

 It is simply Being. 

Again Sri Bhagavan said that in the whole Thayumanavar literature, he preferred one stanza which says:

 “Ego disappearing another ‘I-I’ spontaneously manifests in full glory,” 

etc. 

Again he cites Skandar Anubhuti: “Not real, nor unreal; not darkness nor light, it is.” 

One man said, that a siddha of Kumbakonam claimed to overcome the defects in Sri Sankara’s system which deals only with transcendentalism and not the work-a-day life. One must be able to exercise super-human powers in ordinary life, that is to say, one must be a siddha in order to be perfect. Sri Bhagavan pointed out a stanza in Thayumanavar which condemns all siddhis. Further he said that Thayumanavar mentions mouna (silence) in numerous places but defines it in only one verse.

Mouna is said to be that state which spontaneously manifests after the annihilation of the ego. That state is beyond light and darkness, but still it is called light since no other proper word could be found for it. 

.......

D.: Please tell me the method of reaching the eternal Truth. 

M.: You are That. Can you ever remain apart from the Self? To be yourself requires no effort since you are always That.

 

.......

D.: Again, I repeat, sir, how to know the truth of all this and experience the same? 

M.: There is no gaining of anything new. All that is required is to rid the Self of ignorance. This ignorance is the identification of the Self with the non-Self.

D.: What is the difference between yoga and surrender? 

M.: Surrender is Bhakti Yoga. To reach the source of the ‘I-thought’ is the destruction of the ego, is the attainment of the goal, is prapatti (surrender), jnana, etc.

......

..........Similarly, the Vedas also are eloquent in ‘neti’ - ‘neti’ (not this - not this) and then remain silent. Their silence is the Real State. This is the meaning of exposition by silence. When the source of the ‘I thought’ is reached it vanishes and what remains over is the Self.

.........

D.: Show me the truth of Siddhanta, etc. 

M.: Follow their instructions and then if you have doubts you may ask. Adherence to those instructions will take you only to mouna. Differences are perceived in external objects only. If you follow their instructions all differences will be lost. No one but the son of a king can be called a prince; so also only That which is perfect is called Perfection. One should not be content with mere discipleship, initiation, ceremony of surrender, etc.; these are external phenomena. Never forget the Truth underlying all phenomena.

....

Talk 134. 

A question about the Heart was raised. Sri Bhagavan said that one should seek the Self and realise it. The Heart will play its part automatically. The seat of realisation is the Heart. It cannot be said to be either in or out.

....

M.: Realise the Real Self. It is all that is necessary.

.........

D.: Can we hasten our illumination for greater service? and how? 

M.: As we are not able to help ourselves, so we have to surrender ourselves to the Supreme completely. Then He will take care of us as well as the world. 

D.: What do you consider the goal? 

M.: Self-Realisation. 

D.: Is there any way to meet the appointed Guru for each? 

M.: Intense meditation brings it about.

........

133

Talk 136. 

Dr. G. H. Mees, a young Dutchman, was here for a few days. He asked Sri Bhagavan: “I have an impression that in deep sleep I have something akin to samadhi. Is it so?” 

M.: It is the waking ‘I’ that asks the questions - not the ‘I’ in sleep. If you attain the state of wakeful sleep which is the same as samadhi, while still awake, doubts will not arise.

Samadhi is one’s natural state. 

It is the under current in all the three states. 

This - that is, ‘I’ - is not in those states, but these states are in It. If we get samadhi in our waking state that will persist in deep sleep also. The distinction between consciousness and unconsciousness belongs to the realm of mind, which is transcended by the state of the Real Self.

.....

D.: Is the Buddhist view, that there is no continuous entity answering to the ideas of the individual soul, correct or not? Is this consistent with the Hindu notion of a reincarnating ego? Is the soul a continuous entity which reincarnates again and again, according to the Hindu doctrine, or is it a mere mass of mental tendencies - samskaras? 

M.: The Real Self is continuous and unaffected. The reincarnating ego belongs to the lower plane, namely, thought. It is transcended by Self-Realisation. Reincarnations are due to a spurious offshoot. Therefore it is denied by the Buddhists. The present state is due to a mixing up of the chit (sentient) with jada (insentient).

.....

Talk 137.

 Lakshman Brahmachari of Sri Ramakrishna Mission asked: “Can one imagine oneself as witness of the thoughts?” 

M.: It is not the natural state. It is only an idea (bhavana) - an aid to stilling the mind. 

The Self is ever the witness, whether so imagined or not. There is no need to so imagine except for that purpose. But it is best to remain as one’s Self.

...........

135 experience of samadhi:

D.: What is the experience of samadhi? 

M.: It is as it is. For onlookers it may seem to be a swoon. Even to the practiser it may appear so in the early experiences. 

After a few repeated experiences it will be all right.

 D.: Do they soothe nadis or do they excite them by such experiences? 

M.: They are excited at first. 

By continued experience it becomes common and the man is no longer excited. 

D.: Proceeding on safe lines there should be no unpleasantness. Excitement is uncongenial to smooth being and working. 

M.: A wandering mind is on the wrong way; only a devotional mind is on the right way. 

.........

Talk 139.

 Mr. Ellappa Chettiar, a Member of the Legislative Council, from Salem, asked: “Is it enough to introvert the mind or should we meditate on ‘I am Brahman’?” 

M.: To introvert the mind is the prime thing. 

The Buddhists consider the flow of ‘I’ thought to be Liberation; whereas we say that such flow proceeds from its underlying substratum - the only - Reality. 

Why should one be meditating ‘I am Brahman’? Only the annihilation of ‘I’ is Liberation. 

But it can be gained only by keeping the ‘I-I’ always in view. So the need for the investigation of the ‘I’ thought. If the ‘I’ is not let go, no blank can result to the seeker. Otherwise meditation will end in sleep. There is only one ‘I’ all along, but what arises up from time to time is the mistaken ‘I-thought’; whereas the intuitive ‘I’ always remains Self-shining, i.e. even before it becomes manifest.

The birth of the gross body does not amount to one’s own birth, on the other hand, the birth of the ego is one’s own birth. For liberation, nothing new remains to be gained. It is the original state and continues unchanged too.

..........

Talk 140. 

D.: What is reality? 

M.: Reality must be always real. It is not with forms and names. That which underlies these is the Reality. It underlies limitations, being itself limitless. It is not bound. It underlies unreality, itself being real. Reality is that which is. It is as it is. It transcends speech, beyond the expressions, e.g., existence, non-existence, etc.

Talk 141. .........every sentence imp:

The same gentleman later, after quoting a verse from Kaivalya, asked: “Can jnana be lost after being once attained?” 

M.: Jnana, once revealed, takes time to steady itself. 

The Self is certainly within the direct experience of everyone, but not as one imagines it to be. 

It is only as it is. 

This Experience is samadhi. 

Just as fire remains without scorching against incantations or other devices but scorches otherwise, so also the Self remains veiled by vasanas and reveals itself when there are no vasanas. 

Owing to the fluctuation of the vasanas, jnana takes time to steady itself.

 Unsteady jnana is not enough to check rebirths.

 Jnana cannot remain unshaken side by side with vasanas. 

True, that in the proximity of a great master, the vasanas will cease to be active, the mind becomes still and samadhi results, 

similar to fire not scorching because of other devices.

 Thus the disciple gains true knowledge and right experience in the presence of the master. 

To remain unshaken in it, further efforts are necessary. 

He will know it to be his real Being and thus be liberated even while alive. 

Samadhi with closed eyes is certainly good, but one must go further until it is realised that actionlessness and action are not hostile to each other. 

Fear of loss of samadhi while one is active is the sign of ignorance. 

Samadhi must be the natural life of everyone. 

There is a state beyond our efforts or effortlessness. 

Until it is realised, effort is necessary. 

After tasting such Bliss, even once 

one will repeatedly try to regain it. 

Having once experienced the Bliss of Peace no one would like to be out of it or engaged himself otherwise.

 It is as difficult for a Jnani to engage in thoughts as it is for an ajnani to be free from thought. 

The common man says that he does not know himself. He thinks many thoughts and cannot remain without thinking. 

Any kind of activity does not affect a Jnani. 

His mind remains ever in eternal Peace.

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Talk 142.

 Mr. Prakasa Rao from Bezwada: Does not illusion become inoperative even before identity with Brahman results (Brahmakaravritti)? Or does it persist even afterwards? 

M.: Illusion will not persist after vasanas are annihilated. In the interval between the knowledge of the identity and annihilation of vasanas, there will be illusion.

137

D.: Can the full scope of the Chitta (Chittavilasa) be known?

 M.: Oh! Is this the identity of Brahman? Ignorance vanishing, the residue reveals itself. It is experience, not in the category of knowledge.

..........

D.: Maya is wrong knowledge, illusion. 

M.: For whom is the illusion? 

There must be one to be deluded. Illusion is ignorance. 

The ignorant Self sees the objects according to you. When the objects are not themselves present how can maya exist? Maya is ya ma (maya is what is not). 

What remains over is the true Self. 

If you say that you see the objects, or if you say that you do not know the Real Unity, then are there two selves, one the knower and the other the knowable object. No one will admit of two selves in himself. The awakened man says that he himself was in deep slumber but not aware. He does not say that the sleeper was different from the present one. 

There is only one Self. That Self is always aware. It is changeless. There is nothing but the Self.

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