Edema during dry fasting

https://www.curezone.org/forums/am.asp?i=2245417




Some fasters after a long fast experience Edema. Mostly in there feet and ankles. This is caused by many reasons, most prevalent are Malnutrition, Lack of enough protein, Kidney, Heart or Liver disease.
I suggest if Edema is severe and salt elimination from your diet does not change the swelling then get these tests done.
A chest X-ray
Blood tests
Urine tests
Liver function tests
Heart function tests
Kidney function test
But if the docs give you diuretic drugs, do not take those since that only make this a vicious cycle.
Following explanations may help understand how Edema happens. At the end you will also see some other remedies that will help you. Sorry it is long essay.
Fluid (liquid) rich in nutrients, vitamins and oxygen continuously passes from tiny blood vessels (capillaries) into surrounding tissues - this fluid is known as interstitial fluid (tissue fluid). Interstitial fluid nourishes cells and eventually makes its way back to the capillaries.
Water retention may occur if pressure inside the capillaries changes. Water (fluid) retention is also possible if something occurs that makes the capillary walls too leaky. If something goes wrong with capillary pressure or capillary wall permeability (wall becomes too leaky), excess liquid (fluid) will be released into the tissue spaces between cells. If too much fluid is released more and more of it will remain in the tissues, rather than returning to the capillaries, resulting in swelling and waterlogging (water retention).
The lymphatic system - which consists of a network of vessels throughout the body, drains this fluid from tissues and empties it back into the bloodstream. However, if too much fluid is released in the first place the lymphatic system can be overwhelmed - it is unable to return fluid fast enough, and it accumulates (fluid retention).
Physical inactivity
Physical activity (exercise) helps the leg veins return blood to the heart (against gravity). If the blood does not travel fast enough it will begin to accumulate in the legs, resulting in higher pressure in the capillaries. Fluid will leave the capillaries at a higher rate because of the higher pressure. The higher pressure also makes it harder for fluids to come back later on.
Exercise is also needed to stimulate the lymphatic system to fulfill its function of regulating overflow - bringing fluids back into the bloodstream at rates which may regulate body water levels.
Protein
We require a certain level of proteins for effective water balance. An individual with severe protein deficiency may find it harder to get the water from the tissue spaces back into the capillaries. The enlarged abdomens of seriously malnourished and/or starving people are mainly caused by a lack of protein in their diet.
Salt (sodium) - sodium-rich foods may cause water retention.
Malnutrition and/or bad diet - dietitians say low consumption of thiamine (vitamin B1), as well as insufficient vitamins B6 and B5 may contribute toward fluid retention. Low levels of albumin levels may also play a part - low albumin levels can also be caused by kidney disease.
Celery and parsley, as well as other coumarin-rich foods are key for this diet - coumarin helps macrophages (type of white blood cells) break up proteins which have leaked into the tissue space.
The following self-help precautions may reduce the signs and symptoms of water retention for some people:
Cut down salt consumption.
Do regular exercise.
Raise the legs several times per day to improve circulation.
Wear supporting stockings if the water retention occurs in your lower limbs.
Not to sit/stand still for too long.
Get up and walk about regularly when travelling by car, train.
Avoid extremes of temperature, such as hot baths, showers, and saunas. Dress warmly if it is cold.
Massage - if the affected area is stroked firmly in the direction of the heart it may help move the fluid.














I have read Filonov's book in original. You are right, his "explanation" of how dry-fasting works is a mere speculation. However, his empirical knowledge and methods he developed are undisputedly very valuable. Regarding endogenous water, it is true, when glycogen and/or fat are broken down and utilized, H2O is released. I don't have the refs handy, but the number he gives sounds right.

Regarding the concerns about dehydration, you have to realize that the volume of blood plasma is determined by the amount of sodium in it. The concentration of Na is maintained in a very narrow range. So when Na goes down (quickly on too much water), the volume of blood plasma diminishes. Kidneys work hard to maintain the right concentration of Na. While they dump excess water, they try to conserve Na, but this can't be done beyond a certain gradient and some Na is always lost in urine. This stresses the kidneys and when they can't keep up, the excess water seeps from blood vessels into the extracellular environment, causing edema.

And so, paradoxically, drinking too much water, just as drinking too little, results in the same condition: low volume of plasma and => thickening of the blood. Though I must say that the first case, when one drinks too much, feels much worse than when one drinks none or too little (for many reasons that go beyond just the blood volume). That's the main reason why many novice fasters, having done water fasting all wrong, soon sway into another extreme and start swearing by dry fasting. But I believe that both extremes are unwise. 

On a dry fast, when water becomes scarce, the opposite thing happens from when one drinks too  much: it gets drawn from the tissues into the blood vessels, presumably, with much of what is dissolved in it -- to be filtered by kidneys and liver. I believe in this lies the main therapeutic effect of a dry fast, i.e. the extracellular environment gets forcefully renewed (when the dry fast is broken). Some also say that "heavy water" (with deuterium) gets dumped this way, but that's a speculation.

There are conditions, like what used to be called "dropsy" and various edemas, etc., where dry fasting seems very therapeutic, and people with those conditions sort of "know it by heart" and are naturally drawn to it. As for water fasting, drinking lots of water -- with electrolytes, the main of which is Na++ -- can also be very therapeutic for another set of conditions. Alas, there are a lot of misconceptions in fasting communities where it is widely believed that salt is poison to be avoided at all costs, especially on a fast. That comes from scarce and outdated fasting literature by the likes of Shelton and Bragg. I personally read the scientific literature, both in ru and en, starting with Cahill and Owen in 1960s and then following those who referenced them.

In 2013 a study on dry fasting came out, the first as far as I know, 10 healthy adults, 5 days, "Anthropometric, Hemodynamic, Metabolic, and Renal Responses during 5 Days of Food and Water Deprivation" here: http://www.karger.co...FullText/357718










And guess you did not bother reading my lengthy posts above. Here is a brief summary for you: it's a water fast, not a dry fast, when one should monitor the electrolyte levels.

Also, having read over the years hundreds of fasting reports, though it's true that people put themselves through unnecessary suffering and even sabotage their fasts by drinking much water without supplementing electrolytes, no one ever died of electrolyte imbalance. There was a death though, about a year ago, on curezone. But that woman died of starvation (as in fasting too long).

Hyponatremia is unusual, but I'm using the term "electrolyte imbalance" fairly broadly-  either too much or too little of any of our various ions.   As one example, hyperkalemia can be lethal.  It's not very difficult even for healthy people to become dehydrated (not related to fasting), and there are all manner of problems that crop up in unhealthy people that result in electrolyte issues. That's not counting people doing stupid things like eating or supplementing in very unhealthy ways.  There are a lot of sick people out there, and a lot of people who do things that are ill-advised.

There is a simple test for Na deficiency, which works in healthy people: if you feel mildly thirsty and yet plain water tastes terrible to you and you would rather drink anything but plain water, this is a sure sign of low sodium. Add a pinch of salt to the same water and see how suddenly it becomes delicious.
 

Chew your drinks and drink your foods, or, sip your water, or throw up lol The vomit reflex is dependant on the ion balance between the stomach content and the nerves lining the stomach, but also pressure/presense of contents on a sensitive lining. The mid brain is heavily linked to the stomach, and relies on Niacinimide(made in the Thyroid gland)to biuld Calcium ion content in the nerves, OCD, travel sickness, fear of spiders, fear of speed, nausia from map reading whilst moving, restless legs, are some symptoms of this Calcium Deficient condition caused by low Niacinimide(Not necessarily minerals like Sodium, charged or otherwise!) this is a very well understood mechanism of phsiology.    

https://www.christianforums.com/threads/short-dry-fast.7864933/

One of the reasons people get edema after longer fasting in their low extremities (feet and ankles) is low levels of protein in their blood. Protein serves as a protective layer on the blood vessels for fluids to not sip out through their walls. If you don't have enough, the fluid will sip through and end up causing edema. Also kidney problems can be a major factor in having edema. So you need to stay away from salty foods for a long while after breaking your fast, whether dry fast or water fast.